17A-2000 0602 0702 08022000

Date: 6 Feb 2000.

Location: Bro Ong Swee Tau house at Kepong.

Table of Contents

(A) Bowing is prohibited in the Baitiangong way of obsequies [03:00 – 15:33]
  1. Xian Sheng asked Bro Ong if there were any issues with conducting the Baitiangong way of obsequies for his deceased wife.
  2. Bro Ong replied that he has no issue but as Baitiangong’s obsequies do not need any traditional praying paraphernalia, he felt that many of his friends that worship deities would not find joss sticks for them to burn for the deceased.
  3. Xian Sheng said that those paraphernalia are not necessary.
  4. Bro Ong said that if there were nothing for them to use, they would instead bow their head to the deceased as a sign of respect and requested Xian Sheng to allow this gesture.
  5. Xian Sheng said that it would be best not to allow anyone to bow to the deceased.
  6. Even when a person is alive, it would be best that we do not allow others to bow, beg, kneel down or pray to us.
  7. This is the same in death too as bowing is actually another form of praying.
  8. In communist China during the era of Mao Tse Tung, they do not pray; instead, they bow to both the living and the deceased.
  9. Regardless, when we conduct the Baitiangong way of obsequies, we observe one hundred percent compliance so that everyone can see and familiarise themselves with our way. We want to eliminate all taboos and superstitions from funeral proceedings
  10. Bro Ong agreed with Xian Sheng’s argument. Xian Sheng told him not to worry and leave the funeral arrangements to him.
  11. Xian Sheng pointed out to Bro Ong the upcoming problem would be his eldest daughter who has declared that she would not allow him to follow the Baitiangong way of obsequies.
  12. Xian Sheng suggested to Bro Ong that if he wanted to observe the Baitiangong way of obsequies – which Bro Ong instantly said yes – that he should immediately record his statement on the video camcorder that he wants to follow the Baitiangong way of obsequies, to his children.
  13. Bro Ong reaffirmed that as a Baitiangong follower, he would certainly want to follow the Baitiangong way of obsequies.
  14. Xian Sheng asked Bro Ong whether he has signed the Letter of Intent which is an important document to his funeral arrangements.
  15. Once the Letter of Intent is confirmed by the Commissioner of Oaths to be verifiable and legally compliant, none of his children can override his instructions as the law would take precedence over personal matters. Bro Ong said that he would have to consider this.
  16. Xian Sheng explained that once the Letter of Intent is signed and endorsed by the Commissioner of Oaths, they can report any disturbances to the police and his children could be thrown into the police lockup if they create trouble at his obsequies.
  17. Bro Ong uttered something unclear and Xian Sheng assured him that the most important issue is that his children must not interfere with his obsequies.
  18. Xian Sheng informed Bro Ong that he warned a Christian yesterday at the Baitiangong’s obsequies.  He stated very frankly to Bro Ong that Christians have no manners.
  19. Xian Sheng clarified that his relatives are Christians and he was formerly a Christian too. He left Christianity because he felt it is wrong and choose to pray to the CREATOR directly.
  20. The problem was during his sermon, a Christian stepped forward and started singing out loud. Then he rejoined his fellow Christians and they proceeded to recite Christian prayers.
  21. Xian Sheng could not tolerate his insolent behaviour and warned him. Xian Sheng told him to either listen quietly or leave if he dislike what he heard. Do not try to create trouble there. Baitiangong is not the extremist, they are the extremists and provocateurs.
  22. Xian Sheng asked whether he would dare to act so brazenly if it were a Muslim funeral. He would not dare as the Malay Muslims would catch him and beat him up. However, among the Chinese people, we have more patience.
  23. Xian Sheng did not want to pick a fight with him and only warned him off and the group finally left.
  24. If they had persisted in interrupting the obsequies, we would have been legally obliged to report them to the police, who would then detain them overnight to prevent further disruptions.
  25. It would be ideal to have a Letter of Intent and also a video recording of Bro Ong’s declaration.
  26. Xian Sheng asked Bro Kian whether the video recording have a date and time stamp on it. In the event that we have to lodge a police report, we have the video evidence that the deceased requested for Baitiangong way of obsequies.
  27. The eldest son said that their mother told them that she is a Baitiangong follower but her dying request was that she does not mind if her friends bow to her. 
  28. Xian Sheng interjected saying that she does not understand the implications of bowing. The son insisted that he is only obeying their mother’s wishes.
  29. The son said that Baitiangong’s affairs are their own, but he is adamant to obey his mother’s wishes for the bowing part and he does not care whether it strictly follows Baitiangong’s obsequies or not.
  30. Xian Sheng started to object but the son cut him off by threatening to report to the police and kick Xian Sheng and the followers out. He is not open to any discussion on the matter.
  31. Xian Sheng referred to his father as his father had agreed to the part that disallows bowing to the deceased. However, the son disregards his father’s wish over his mother’s wish. He stated once again that his mother’s wish was that she does not mind if her friends bow to her.
  32. Xian Sheng spelt it out to him that his father holds the rights [bad audio]. However, the son put his foot down and told Xian Sheng that his mother wishes allows for people to pay their respects in their own way.
  33. Xian Sheng reiterated that his father holds the rights. The son repeated that the dead person’s wishes must be followed.
  34. Xian Sheng rephrased stating that his father who is the husband holds the rights for his wife and not the children.
  35. The son futilely tried to insist that his mother’s wish supersedes his father’s authority but Xian Sheng put him in his place with his familiarity with the law.
  36. The son then referred to some impending trouble that might arise on that day if people are not allowed to bow to the deceased.  Xian Sheng asked him to clarify those trouble and who would be involved.
  37. The son changed his argument from their mother’s wish to their wishes instead because he finally realised that his father clearly has the authority here.
  38. The son asked who will be paying the cost for any court case that may arise if there were to be trouble. However, he said that he would prefer a smooth obsequy.
  39. Xian Sheng finally told the son to take over the funeral if their wish is to obey their mother’s wishes that her friends should be allowed to bow to her during the Baitiangong’s obsequies. 
  40. Xian Sheng added that it does not matter to him if he does not conduct the obsequies for his mother.1
  41. The second son stepped in and said that they want to follow their mother’s wishes for the Baitiangong way of obsequies but there are many stubborn people.  [Bad audio]
  42. He said that Malaysia is a free country with free religious practices which grant everyone the right to do what they like and they cannot stop anyone from doing what they want at the funeral.
  43. Xian Sheng supported his statement about Malaysia being a free country with free religious practices. He added that once a person adopts the religion, they would follow its practices and customs.
  44. The son argued that the religion of the individual supersede the religion of the deceased.
  45. Xian Sheng countered that his argument is faulty and asked him to try to impose his religious rights at a Muslim funeral.
  46. The son immediately discounted Muslim funeral from the argument. He argued that bowing is about respect to both the living and the deceased and has nothing to do with praying to someone.
  47. The son said that he will not pray to Baitiangong as he prays to something else or someone. But as he loves his mother, he will bow to his mother in respect.2
  48. The son said that they have come to an impasse and ask what can be done about it.3
  49. Xian Sheng would not compromise with him and told the son to kick him. (likely kick them out from conducting the funeral.) The son said that he would kick Xian Sheng out if it were his mother’s wish. (Assuming that his mother’s wish is not to follow the Baitiangong way of obsequies.)
  50. Xian Sheng told him that since his father was the one who invited him over, it may not be the son who would kick Xian Sheng out of the house but Xian Sheng would do the kicking instead. The son warned Xian Sheng not to threaten them in their house.
(B) Lack of understanding of the Spiritual Guidelines [15:33 – 27:14]
  1. The son said that he attended Church and Chinese Temples in the past. However, he has stopped going the Church. Nevertheless, he respects all religions.
  2. He stated that there are no religions that do not allow someone to bow to respect another person.
  3. He bows to a person out of respect for them and not because he subscribes to their religion.
  4. He was expressing his personal experience as he had gone to a lot of funerals and witnessed many funeral ceremonies.
  5. Xian Sheng said that he does not know about other religious practices. (Xian Sheng respects other religious ceremonies although he may disagree with them.) As for Baitiangong, we have our sign/placard to inform the public not to bow, kneel or pray to the deceased.
  6. The second son asked Xian Sheng to amend the placard to allow individuals to bow to his mother.
  7. Xian Sheng told them that they can bow as much as they like to her when they retrieve her body from the hospital. They can even bow to her when her body is in the hospital. No one is stopping them from bowing as much as they like.
  8. But when Baitiangong takes possession of the body for obsequies, no one will be allowed to bow to the deceased.
  9. Bro Chang Yoong Wah added that they have to respect the Baitiangong way of obsequies, or else they can conduct their own funeral for their mother.
  10. Xian Sheng repeated his statement to emphasise that they can bow as much as they like to their mother when the body is in their possessions, but once Xian Sheng conducts the Baitiangong way of obsequies, they will try to stop individuals from bowing to the deceased.
  11. The family conducted their discussion about the bowing issue.
  12. Bro Ong finally relented to his children’s demand and requested Xian Sheng to allow anyone who wishes to bow to be allowed to do so.
  13. The son added that religion should respect (cut short by Xian Sheng.)
  14. Xian Sheng reassured Bro Ong that they will inform the public in a civil manner not to bow although they will strictly enforce Baitiangong’s guidelines on obsequies.
  15. The son commented about the placard placed in from of the coffin to inform the public not to bow, kneel or pray to the deceased. 
  16. Bro Ong tried once again to inform Xian Sheng that bowing is a gesture of respect and not praying to the deceased. 
  17. Xian Sheng responded to the son informing him that we have used the placard for 20 years but he would expect Xian Sheng to change it, just to accommodate them.
  18. The second son said that they do not object to the placard, but asked Xian Sheng for leniency to allow the people to bow if they refused to follow the instruction. 
  19. Xian Sheng flatly refused him and said that followers will stand in their way if they insist on bowing.
  20. The son questioned Xian Sheng for putting followers to stand guard in front of the coffin.
  21. A sister tried to explain that Baitiangong request the public not to bow to the deceased as it is not necessary to express respect in that manner. She tried to explain that kneeling down to pray to the CREATOR would be a better way to express their respect. 
  22. Bro Ong still insisted that bowing to the deceased is a minor issue but he agreed that praying to the coffin is not allowed. Instead, the followers should encourage them that if they wanted to pray, they should go outside, kneel down and pray to the CREATOR for the deceased.
  23. Xian Sheng explained that we have conducted hundreds of Baitiangong’s obsequies and we have never allowed anyone to bow. How would we justify our stand all these years if we allow the public to bow in Bro Ong’s wife’s obsequy?
  24. Once again, Xian Sheng repeated that if the sons want to bow to their mother, they can bow as much as they like after they retrieve the deceased from the hospital. However, once Baitiangong takes over the deceased, no one would be allowed to bow to the deceased.
  25. The second son tried to redirect the argument stating that it is the friends of their mother that would be doing the bowing and not them. Xian Sheng simply told him to inform their friends that they should not bow.
  26. Bro Ong said that the placard stated no bowing and the individuals should follow Baitiangong’s constitution (actually it is our Spiritual Guidelines) and just walk around the coffin to pay their last respects. However, he added that the followers should advise the public in a civil manner that if they wanted to express their respect, they do not need to bow to the deceased, but instead go outside to kneel down and pray to the CREATOR for the deceased. When implementing the strict guidelines, it is important for the followers to refrain from acting like authoritarians but instead communicate their requests in a civilised manner, avoiding the use of commands when telling them not to bow. He was trying to diffuse the tension between his sons and Xian Sheng as both had taken a hard stance.
  27. Bro Chang Yoong Wah explained that the followers have always been courteous when we deal with the public.4 He pointed out to Bro Ong that our biggest concern now is if his children were to protest when we are explaining to their friends as that would make the entire obsequies go awry. 
  28. Bro Chang clarified that in all of the obsequies we have conducted so far, the public reads the placard and followed our instructions.
  29. Sis Shee Yeat May informed Bro Ong that his wife apparently did not know about the Spiritual Guidelines on bowing. Bro Chang added that she had never participated in any obsequies in the past too. 
  30. Sis Shee added that she would have never made such a request for friends to bow to her if she understood Baitiangong’s Spiritual Guidelines. Sis Wong Chew Peng stated that the problem they faced now is a result of a grave misunderstanding.
  31. Sis Shee said that if they understood the situation, they should explain to their friends why they should not bow. If they are still not clear on the Spiritual Guidelines, we would gladly explain to them again. 
  32. Bro Chang said that they would be very courteous in their explanation to their friends. He raised their concern once again about the family protesting when they are explaining as that would jeopardise their standing with their friends. He repeated that in all their previous obsequies, the public has always respected their guidelines and followed the instructions.
  33. Xian Sheng said that those who can read the placard never bowed to the deceased and reconfirmed that in all the obsequies that he conducted, he never faced such problems before.
  34. Bro Ong is satisfied and concurred with their statements.  
  35. Xian Sheng reiterated to Bro Ong that he has the authority to decide matters now. However, when his time comes in the future, he would face a big problem with his obsequy. That is why he must clearly state his intentions to his sons and daughters.
  36. Bro Ong explained that his daughters have married out of the family and therefore not an issue.5
  37. Therefore the problem is limited to his sons only. As his sons follow his spiritual belief and are also Baitiangong followers, he felt that his obsequies should not be an issue. The only issue they have is that they wanted bowing to be allowed as they believe that it is only a form of respect.
  38. The eldest son said that they would follow their father’s instructions to the letter although he admitted that he no longer follows his father’s belief, contrary to what his father said about both his sons following his belief. The second son reaffirmed their commitment to follow their father’s wishes. 
  39. The issue now lies with their mother’s wishes only. The sons prioritise their mother’s dying wish over everything, giving the example that the deceased can choose either cremation or burial as their personal preference. 
  40. The son stated that, to the best of his knowledge, all religions must follow the final and dying requests of the deceased. 
  41. Xian Sheng refuted his view about the deceased’s last wish preference.6

Note: 

Baitiangong Universal Spiritual Movement, BUSM, is not a religion but a Spiritual Movement. Religions have beliefs, dogmas and doctrines handed down by the gods themselves, but are not universally accepted and at times incomprehensible in the present era. The rules and rituals are made by man and fixed in the era it was created rendering them obsolete in the present era. 

BUSM teachings can be explained logically and rationally. It does not involve GOD setting rules that must be obeyed but guidelines set by Xian Sheng to guide the individual’s spiritual development and are applicable to all people universally regardless of their religious belief and in any era. Two of the Spiritual Guidelines must be strictly followed to eliminate wastage, superstitions and taboos that are ever present in marriages and obsequies. Religions have rules that are applicable to their followers only, but Baitiangong’s Spiritual Guidelines are applicable to everyone.

(C) Do it right the first time [27:14 – 31:58]
  1. Xian Sheng shared an article that he read from the newspaper recently on what the Muslims did when a Chinese Muslim was not buried according to the Muslim funeral.  
  2. The Chinese parents buried their son in a Chinese cemetery but when the Muslims found out about it, they dug up the body and buried the body in a Muslim cemetery.
  3. The father is a Muslim but he did not inform the Imam about the death of his son.7
  4. The Imam did not know about the burial that took place in Seremban. The Imam only found out about it because the deceased did not pay his tithe. When they search for him in his home, they found out that he had passed away. The Imam was outrageous because the son was a Muslim.8
  5. The Imam seek a court order (from the Syariah Court) to have the body exhumed and transferred to a Muslim cemetery where they conducted an Islamic burial. That is the Muslim way and they couldn’t care less about the family’s wishes as the son was a Muslim.
  6. Xian Sheng explained in Cantonese for the benefit of Bro Ong. 
  7. He added that that would be considered extreme when compared with the Baitiangong way. 
  8. Bro Ong said that he also read about that news in the newspaper. 
  9. Xian Sheng said that the Chinese protested against their actions but their efforts were in vain. 
  10. Bro Ong said that once a person becomes a Muslim, they must follow the Muslim ways.
  11. Xian Sheng stated that Islam does not allow bowing to the deceased.9 
  12. Xian Sheng added that someone may even walk up and smack the person who bowed to the deceased. Xian Sheng said that the followers are not extremists like that. 
  13. He informed Bro Ong that he told his sons not to bow to the deceased, but if they insisted, he has no issues with them bowing to their mother once the coffin arrives from the hospital. They can bow as much as they liked. However, once Xian Sheng arrived and took over possession of the coffin, they are not allowed to bow anymore.
  14. Bro Ong requested Xian Sheng to assign one or two followers to explain to their friends that arrived early why they should not bow to the deceased.
  15. The second son suggested that they should not place the coffin in a spot where their friends could easily walk up and bow to the deceased.  
  16. Bro Chang told them to leave the arrangements to them. His main concern which was not addressed yet is that the family members would object when they explain to the public why they should not bow to the deceased. 
  17. [In the background, we can see the relatives and the family moving away for a private discussion. They came back in a short while and tried to stop the recording and a struggle ensued.]
D) Bowing is not a good practise [48:35 – 49:25]

Date: 7 Feb 2000

  1. Xian Sheng asked the youngest daughter if she understood what needed to be done in the event of her father’s death. Bro Ong’s leg was amputated because of diabetes, but when the body dies, the soul would be made whole again. 
  2. The daughter asked if the body would be nothing, an empty shell and the soul would move on and go somewhere else. 
  3. Xian Sheng acknowledges and explained that what is most important is for the soul to go to Heaven. That is why the brothers and sisters gathered at obsequies as their main objective is to pray to the CREATOR to forgive the sins of the deceased and if deserving, to give the soul a good place in Heaven. She said that she understood Xian Sheng’s explanation.
  4. She explained to Xian Sheng that some of them (her siblings and relatives) are really emotional. Bro Tan chipped in saying that this was perhaps due to the fact they do not understand Baitiangong’s teachings. 

Note. In contemporary times, many Chinese people are unaware of the history and implications of bowing to the deceased and only attribute it as a gesture of respect and honour to the deceased.

During the Chinese communist era of Mao Tse Tung, the government discouraged traditional religious practices and beliefs, including ancestor worship. The Communist Party of China, under Mao’s leadership, promoted atheism and discouraged religious beliefs and practices as it was seen as a threat to communist ideology.

Therefore, it is unlikely that people were allowed to kneel and pray to the dead during this period. The government discouraged such practices as they were viewed as superstitions and counter-revolutionary activities. However, it is important to note that despite the government’s efforts to suppress religious practices, some people continued to practice their beliefs in secret or in a modified form to avoid persecution. That is why they bow to the deceased.

The Divine Law of Nature dictates that humans can only be subservient to the CREATOR. Xian Sheng explained when humans are subservient to made-made objects like idols or statues, their life force energy would be leeched by the objects they pray or worship. Xian Sheng used the term Spiritual Vampirism to explain this phenomenon. He discouraged people from bowing, begging, kneeling or praying to another living person because these habits would naturally be applied to the deceased and objects representing their deities too. In the worst-case scenario, these objects could influence their mind making them do what they would usually not do. The more relevant point is that they have gone against the Divine Law of Nature, whether innocently or out of ignorance.

In general, Christians and Muslims do not bow to the deceased. They offer prayers instead. The Chinese people bow because of the traditional ancestral worship that was handed down through the generations. Xian Sheng has always tried to discourage undesirable cultural practices through Baitiangong teachings but when it comes to the Baitiangong way of obsequies, he would not compromise. If the Chinese people wants to express their respect and honour the deceased, they could do what the Christians and Muslims are already doing – pray for the deceased.

  1. A Baitiangong obsequies is very important for a Baitiangong follower as it is the final action and statement of their commitment to Baitiangong. The duty of the follower is fulfilled even if unforeseen and undesirable circumstances changed their funeral arrangements if they had chosen the Baitiangong way of obsequies. Xian Sheng stated very clearly that the sins of changing the funeral arrangement would be borne by the person who goes against the Baitiangong way of obsequies.
  2. The children obviously do not know that Baitiangong means praying to the one and only CREATOR. Chinese religions are polytheistic in nature and he assumed that Baitiangong is about praying to another deity in the large pantheon of Chinese deities. He argued that bowing is a universal gesture of respect and not about praying or worshipping a person.
  3. He wanted Xian Sheng to compromise with him so that they can fulfil their mother's wishes to conduct the Baitiangong way of obsequies and for her friends to bow to her if they wish to pay their respects.
  4. One of the important aspects of the obsequies is to promote Baitiangong to the Chinese people and therefore what Bro Ong indicated about acting like authoritarians is never an issue as that goes against the spirit of preaching.
  5. In traditional Chinese culture, daughters are expected to leave their parents' household after marriage and move in with their husband's family. As a result, they may have limited involvement in their parents' affairs, particularly if they live far away.
  6. In Judaism and Islam, there are specific customs and rituals that must be followed in the preparation and burial of the deceased, and these may take precedence over the last wishes of the individual. Similarly, with Baitiangong, the Spiritual Guidelines must be strictly followed and this would not have been an issue if the followers know and understood them.
  7. A Mufti is a Muslim legal expert who makes decisions based on religious laws. Xian Sheng is referring to an Imam, who is the leader of a mosque or Islamic community. The Imam may be called upon to lead funeral prayers, offer spiritual guidance to the family, and provide support in arranging the funeral and burial.
  8. In Islam, the tithe is known as zakat. Muslims are required to pay zakat on their wealth on an annual basis. There are specific occasions on which Muslims are encouraged to give additional charitable donations, known as "sadaqah." On the occasion of Aidil-Fitri and Aidil-Adha, Muslims are encouraged to give sadaqah.
  9. In Islam, there is no specific practice of bowing to the deceased as a form of respect or mourning. Muslims believe that once a person has died, their soul has left their physical body and has moved on to the afterlife. Therefore, the body of the deceased is considered to be a lifeless object and not worthy of worship or reverence. However, Muslims do show respect and honour to the deceased by offering funeral prayers and performing burial rites according to Islamic customs. This includes washing the body, shrouding it in plain white cloth, and burying it as soon as possible after death.